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Blackjack Session Bankroll?

Discussion in 'Table Games' started by G21G17, May 18, 2017.

  1. G21G17

    G21G17 Bronze
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    When I usually play blackjack, I'll buy in for 10x my max bet (usually $5-$10 hand, so $50-$100). I always have a stop limit of 4 max bets remaining. I'll walk away if I get down to just those 4 chips. I usually plan on 2-3 sessions a day at that buy in, so I'll have $150-$300 to play BJ with that day. I'll walk away if I double up my buy in or if I feel the cards are changing and I'm ahead. I know I'm probably leaving money on the table, but this strategy a) has really limited my losses b) allowed me to walk away with at least 2-3x my max bet most of the time. My sessions are short, usually no more than 30 minutes to an hour. If I'm winning, I'll do several of these sessions a day.

    I'm going to increase my bets to $25 next go around. Should I keep this same strategy and buy in at $250 or should I go up to $500 and play longer? If so, should my stop loss be $250 or 10x bet? My daily BJ BR will be $500. I'm fine only playing two sessions a day so that won't be an issue. I'll be playing some VP and Slots out of a different BR each day.

    Just looking for some advice as I slowly move up to bigger bets.
     
    NickPappageorgio likes this.
  2. Sindustry

    Sindustry Palladium
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    What has worked for me, in losing less, at the tables, is playing through my buy-in once. I keep all wins in a separate pile. Once I have played through my initial stack of chips, I will either color up and leave, or play through one more round. Unless you lose every single hand, you should be able to walk away with something.
     
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  3. scottndindy

    scottndindy Bronze

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    I do not recommend sitting down without at least 20 playing units.
     
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  4. G21G17

    G21G17 Bronze
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    Why's that?
     
  5. G21G17

    G21G17 Bronze
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    I like this. This makes sense to me. I think I shall try this at least once.
     
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  6. MonteCarloPlayer

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    I feel a ton more lucky having ammo in front of me, in units. If at a $100 table I need at least 30 units... I do tilt sometimes and throw more chips in than I oughta, but that's how it goes, right?? :)
     
  7. scottndindy

    scottndindy Bronze

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    Risk of ruin too high with less units. You need to be able to ride the ups and downs. If you look at casino stats you will see hold rates of 15-20 percent on a game with a .5 percent advantage. If everyone played correctly and had unlimited resources these numbers would be much closer but people buy in too small and over bet. Sitting down with too small of bankroll is asking to lose as any deviation will bankrupt you.
     
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  8. Wanker751

    Wanker751 Palladium
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    I need to try this. I usually spend too much time at the tables and get felted.

    You do this with UTH as well? Cause I usually don't walk away from there.
     
  9. NickPappageorgio

    NickPappageorgio Anonymous Husband
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    I agree with this. You have to have enough to ride out the swings.
     
  10. topcard

    topcard Resident Downtown Low-Roller
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    As others have posted, I also think that 20x your base-bet is the rule-of-thumb to follow... you have to survive the inevitable variance.
    Sometimes, you get lucky and the hands balance out according to the math/odds...but it's very unusual to see that over the course of just an hour or so of play.

    If you're going to count, then the table minimum ought to be lower than your base-bet...that way, on very negative counts, you can reduce to below your base.
    (Base-bet ought to represent an 'even' count, or what you play when you're flat-betting).

    For UTH, I use a buy-in rate of 40-60x my ante-bet.
     
  11. Sindustry

    Sindustry Palladium
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    UTH is where I first started this bankroll management method and is still my primary table game.
     
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  12. Wanker751

    Wanker751 Palladium
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    I am in your debt sir. Thanks for the tip, I will try this next time
     
  13. Chuck

    Chuck Gold
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    Totally agree with this. I usually buy in for 20 - 40x on tables and then rathole some of it, mostly for security purposes. Some of it depends on whether you mind getting actually felted, or whether you get psychologically felted. Either way, especially when you're getting killed early in a session, you'll almost always be able to claw a lot of it back if you can keep playing. But if you bust out fast, you lock in the loss.

    The table game I play most is craps. My biggest losing sessions in terms of loss-as-a-% of total amount bet have always been short sessions with low buy ins, and the lowest loss %s have always been like 4 hour sessions.
     
    #13 Chuck, May 20, 2017
    Last edited: May 21, 2017
  14. simpatt

    simpatt Silver
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    Agree with the advice here, I'll buy in for 20x and this almost always seems to last a solid few hrs at least. I cash out at 2x my bankroll.
     
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  15. rycelover

    rycelover Move along folks, nothing to see here ...
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    Everyone has a plan 'till they get punched in the mouth. - Mike Tyson

    As others have wisely stated, I will always buy in for 20x my base bet and make sure I have more in my pocket to ride out variance. Some days you out-pace her and come up positive and other days, no matter what you do or how many spots you play or much you have, you just don't seem to have enough.
     
    #15 rycelover, Jun 10, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2017
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  16. 44inarow

    44inarow Cool Story Bro

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    20x here as well (I usually play $50 or $100), but always make sure I have a reserve. Not so much for variance, but in case I come up with double and/or split scenarios when I'm running low. The only thing worse than getting felted is drawing an eleven against a bust card and not having the cash for that last double.
     
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  17. Willie

    Willie AKA Hugo Hackenbush
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    buy in 20 to 30 times average flat bet........ Once and if and when the voodoo,,, witchcraft,,,,,,, impossible crap starts to happen and the dealer is on fire,,,,,,, run for your life,,,, hopefully ahead $$$ and go to the full baccarat table...
     
  18. thefish2010

    thefish2010 Silver
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    You actually bring up an important point. BJ not only has a ton of variance, but a minimum bankroll requirement. It is not the game to go all-in at. Never bet more than 1/4th of your remaining bankroll on BJ.

    Why would I say this? Because while blackjack generally has a house edge of about 0.5%* for a perfect basic strategy player depending on rules, making it one of the best bets in the house, if you cannot double or split, that edge goes up by more than 6x, making it one of the worst games in the house for you. As hard as it is to get up when you are getting beaten badly and you just want to throw that last Hail Mary pass, you should take that last bet and place it on the banker on baccarat. It has a much smaller edge than you will face with no ability to double/split on BJ, and it is one of the few bets in the entire casino that you will actually win slightly more often than you lose.

    *I am referring to 3:2 blackjack, not 6:5. If you are at a 6:5 game, please see this very short (6 second) video...

     
    #18 thefish2010, Jun 26, 2017 at 6:56 AM
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2017 at 7:02 AM
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  19. topcard

    topcard Resident Downtown Low-Roller
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    For the "hail mary" bet, there are two better options:
    UTH or 3-Card Poker, playing 'blind'.
    For UTH, bet 15% of bankroll on both the Ante & Blind, 60% on the 'Play' and 10% on Trips. You have a 50/50 chance of winning at least your 'Play' bet.

    For 3-Card, bet 50% each on the Ante & 'Play'. You have a better than 50/50 chance of winning at least the 'Ante' bet, since if the dealer fails to have a Q-high or better, you win even if he has a better hand than you. If you both have Q-high or better, you have a 50/50 chance of winning on both bets.

    Just bear in mind that this only holds true as a 'one-time' bet only - for either game... Your odds are always 50/50 (or better) but only in terms of the cards - not the amount of the win vs the amount wagered.
    (of course, the same is true for betting 'banker' in Bacc... but UTH & 3-card are usually lower limits, and far more readily available).
     
  20. thefish2010

    thefish2010 Silver
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    I don't know the exact edges on UTH or 3 Card off the top of my head, but I would be willing to bet almost anything that they have a higher edge than the 1.064% you will face on the baccarat banker bet. I was simply saying that mathematically speaking, if you want to do a quick Hail Mary with only one bet, the best bet you can make (best mix of simplicity, speed, house edge, and variance) is the banker IMO. To each his own though, if you happen to like 3 card or UTH, then by all means go for it...you'll just lose more over time with those games.

    There are others (craps with odds etc) that have somewhat lower edges, but you won't be able to just one-shot it. And again, the banker bet is the only one where you will win slightly more than 50% of the time (the house makes up for this with commission).
     
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